Comments on: NPF: CHEATING http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/ OPIATE OF THE ASSES Fri, 10 Feb 2012 21:36:51 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: tailender http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-24540 tailender Wed, 14 Apr 2010 03:09:19 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-24540 It's interesting to see the moral reaction to occupational drug use. Classical musicians - OK it helps them play to the best of their abilities and that's what we want to hear. Baseball players - Not OK it's cheating! Long distance truck drivers - I HOPE that guy driving that big truck behind me is at least drinking coffee! College students? well if college is all about learning than maybe concentration aids are OK. If it's about competition than maybe they are not. It's interesting to see the moral reaction to occupational drug use. Classical musicians – OK it helps them play to the best of their abilities and that's what we want to hear. Baseball players – Not OK it's cheating! Long distance truck drivers – I HOPE that guy driving that big truck behind me is at least drinking coffee! College students? well if college is all about learning than maybe concentration aids are OK. If it's about competition than maybe they are not.

]]> By: jazzbumpa http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-21605 jazzbumpa Sun, 24 Jan 2010 17:19:26 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-21605 There's also a difference between the musician's beta blockers and the athlete's steroids, etc. that no one has mentioned. The beta blockers enable the musicians to do what they are capable of doing, whether by reducing anxiety, increasing focus, or whatever mechanism. The steroids enable the athletes to do things they otherwise <b>would not be able to do.</b> This difference is not subtle, and can functionally provide a difference between cheating and not. Similarly, the students. Whatever they are taking doesn't give them the equivalent of an open-book exam when other students are in closed book mode. It helps them do what they are able to do. That said, I am highly suspicious of pills at all times. Mucking around with your basic body chemistry moves you quickly into an unknown area. I think our culture's desire for magic bullet answers to complex questions enables a pill-popping society, and this is a consequence. As an aside, I once heard a young lady commenting on her little brother's ADD. "Mom gives him a cup of coffee in the morning, and he's fine." Caffeine is about as good as Ritalin, and has fewer side effects. But big pharma doesn't get a cut. Pity. Cheers! JzB There's also a difference between the musician's beta blockers and the athlete's steroids, etc. that no one has mentioned. The beta blockers enable the musicians to do what they are capable of doing, whether by reducing anxiety, increasing focus, or whatever mechanism. The steroids enable the athletes to do things they otherwise would not be able to do.

This difference is not subtle, and can functionally provide a difference between cheating and not.

Similarly, the students. Whatever they are taking doesn't give them the equivalent of an open-book exam when other students are in closed book mode. It helps them do what they are able to do.

That said, I am highly suspicious of pills at all times. Mucking around with your basic body chemistry moves you quickly into an unknown area.

I think our culture's desire for magic bullet answers to complex questions enables a pill-popping society, and this is a consequence.

As an aside, I once heard a young lady commenting on her little brother's ADD. "Mom gives him a cup of coffee in the morning, and he's fine." Caffeine is about as good as Ritalin, and has fewer side effects. But big pharma doesn't get a cut. Pity.

Cheers!
JzB

]]> By: waldo http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-21601 waldo Sun, 24 Jan 2010 13:47:45 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-21601 <i>There is simply too much drug-taking in society.</I> That's true but it's more correct to say that there's far too much drug-taking in American society. http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/FASTATS/drugs.htm Despite tough anti-drug laws, a new survey shows the U.S. has the highest level of illegal drug use in the world. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/07/01/health/webmd/main4222322.shtml This: http://www.minyanville.com/articles/10/27/2009/index/a/25132 could offer some explanation to the US current financial woes. Everybody is aware the amphetamines, the drug most associated with aggressive behaviour is policy in the US armed forces. http://www.allpositiveoptions.com/APOMeth25.htm How ironic that the two things that will drive you nuts quickest, guns and drugs, are so integral in the US social fabric. There is simply too much drug-taking in society. That's true but it's more correct to say that there's far too much drug-taking in American society.
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/FASTATS/drugs.htm
Despite tough anti-drug laws, a new survey shows the U.S. has the highest level of illegal drug use in the world.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/07/01/health/webmd/main4222322.shtml

This: http://www.minyanville.com/articles/10/27/2009/index/a/25132
could offer some explanation to the US current financial woes.

Everybody is aware the amphetamines, the drug most associated with aggressive behaviour is policy in the US armed forces. http://www.allpositiveoptions.com/APOMeth25.htm

How ironic that the two things that will drive you nuts quickest, guns and drugs, are so integral in the US social fabric.

]]> By: Dustin http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-21598 Dustin Sun, 24 Jan 2010 00:21:11 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-21598 If students really need to take speed to do well at the undergraduate level, they are probably beyond help anyway. If students really need to take speed to do well at the undergraduate level, they are probably beyond help anyway.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-21596 Andrew Sat, 23 Jan 2010 17:29:44 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-21596 I don't know. I suspect that regular drug use probably ends up exacerbating the symptoms you're trying to quell - artificially inducing concentration or calmness or what have you makes it very difficult to learn how to summon up those mental states on your own. That said, I think that if we want people to exceed themselves academically or artistically or athletically, we either have to: A) Allow them the time, training, time, effort, and time to get to that level. B) Accept that if they aren't given the luxuries of A), they're going to short-cut for the results. I honestly think that we're too focused on getting everything squared away in our lives before the ago of thirty. It might have been necessary once upon a time, but with rapidly increasing life spans and ever-improving medical technology that is increasing one's useful lifespan at the same rate, taking your time isn't nearly as bad as it once was. You can work until you're 65 or 70 and still have, potentially, 15 to 20 years of retirement and globe-trotting. Today's Baby Boomers are expected to live until they're 92 on average, and they're expected to be ambulatory and self-sufficient and healthy until 85 on average (a startling but true fact). Why put our young people under so much pressure to succeed and exceed by their mid-twenties if they can expect to be around and leading fulfilled lives past the age of 100? The few people naturally predisposed to brilliant physics discoveries by the age of 23 will continue to do so, and we wouldn't be pressuring those who aren't predisposed to operate at that level to take drugs to try and fake it. I don't know. I suspect that regular drug use probably ends up exacerbating the symptoms you're trying to quell – artificially inducing concentration or calmness or what have you makes it very difficult to learn how to summon up those mental states on your own.

That said, I think that if we want people to exceed themselves academically or artistically or athletically, we either have to:

A) Allow them the time, training, time, effort, and time to get to that level.
B) Accept that if they aren't given the luxuries of A), they're going to short-cut for the results.

I honestly think that we're too focused on getting everything squared away in our lives before the ago of thirty. It might have been necessary once upon a time, but with rapidly increasing life spans and ever-improving medical technology that is increasing one's useful lifespan at the same rate, taking your time isn't nearly as bad as it once was. You can work until you're 65 or 70 and still have, potentially, 15 to 20 years of retirement and globe-trotting. Today's Baby Boomers are expected to live until they're 92 on average, and they're expected to be ambulatory and self-sufficient and healthy until 85 on average (a startling but true fact).

Why put our young people under so much pressure to succeed and exceed by their mid-twenties if they can expect to be around and leading fulfilled lives past the age of 100?

The few people naturally predisposed to brilliant physics discoveries by the age of 23 will continue to do so, and we wouldn't be pressuring those who aren't predisposed to operate at that level to take drugs to try and fake it.

]]> By: j http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-21592 j Sat, 23 Jan 2010 10:07:48 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-21592 Speaking of performance-enhancing drugs, here's one of the classics that reminds me of the halcyon days of youth and good comedy. http://www.hulu.com/watch/4090/saturday-night-live-weekend-update-all-drug-olympics Speaking of performance-enhancing drugs, here's one of the classics that reminds me of the halcyon days of youth and good comedy.

http://www.hulu.com/watch/4090/saturday-night-live-weekend-update-all-drug-olympics

]]> By: RD http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-21585 RD Sat, 23 Jan 2010 02:19:38 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-21585 As a recovering classical musician, I can attest that beta blockers are (or were, at least) used by many players. However, your argument, in my opinion, is lacking two very important contexts. 1.) The Boston Pops, to my knowledge, does not have a Federal anti-trust waiver, so any form of drug use among it's members is between the organization, it's members, their union and not COngress. And 2.) Art is not athletics. Yes, both require a mastery physical skills that can be enhanced by the use of certain drugs, but the means and the ends are hardly the same. "You see, I think drugs have done some good things for us. I really do. And if you don't believe drugs have done good things for us, do me a favor. Go home tonight. Take all your albums, all your tapes and all your CDs and burn them. 'Cause you know what, the musicians that made all that great music that's enhanced your lives throughout the years were rrreal fucking high on drugs. The Beatles were so fucking high they let Ringo sing a few tunes." - Bill Hicks As a recovering classical musician, I can attest that beta blockers are (or were, at least) used by many players. However, your argument, in my opinion, is lacking two very important contexts. 1.) The Boston Pops, to my knowledge, does not have a Federal anti-trust waiver, so any form of drug use among it's members is between the organization, it's members, their union and not COngress. And 2.) Art is not athletics. Yes, both require a mastery physical skills that can be enhanced by the use of certain drugs, but the means and the ends are hardly the same.

"You see, I think drugs have done some good things for us. I really do. And if you don't believe drugs have done good things for us, do me a favor. Go home tonight. Take all your albums, all your tapes and all your CDs and burn them. 'Cause you know what, the musicians that made all that great music that's enhanced your lives throughout the years were rrreal fucking high on drugs. The Beatles were so fucking high they let Ringo sing a few tunes." – Bill Hicks

]]> By: Peggy http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-21583 Peggy Sat, 23 Jan 2010 01:34:13 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-21583 Gingersnapper--I'm with ya. I'd also like to see these add-ons for classical music, while we're enhancing performances! Gingersnapper–I'm with ya. I'd also like to see these add-ons for classical music, while we're enhancing performances!

]]> By: Gingersnapper http://www.ginandtacos.com/2010/01/22/npf-cheating/comment-page-1/#comment-21578 Gingersnapper Fri, 22 Jan 2010 22:19:02 +0000 http://www.ginandtacos.com/?p=3014#comment-21578 I've always believed that professional athletes should be allowed to take whatever performance-enhancing drugs they want: steroids, amphetamines, beta blockers, whatever. LSD, opiates... also I think they should have all sorts of experimental surgery like muscle implants, limb lengthening, wings, springs in their feet, etc. That would make sports MUCH more entertaining. I've always believed that professional athletes should be allowed to take whatever performance-enhancing drugs they want: steroids, amphetamines, beta blockers, whatever. LSD, opiates… also I think they should have all sorts of experimental surgery like muscle implants, limb lengthening, wings, springs in their feet, etc. That would make sports MUCH more entertaining.

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